Cold Steel

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Posts by Cold Steel

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  28

  Taking the Bible Lessons And Going To a KH For First Time

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've taken the bible lessons but have never attended a kingdom hall.

  i was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control?

  let's say you're a baptist.

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  Cold Steel

  How heavy were the gold plates?

  https://youtube.com/watch?v=OyTBtRAIqkw
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  28

  Taking the Bible Lessons And Going To a KH For First Time

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've taken the bible lessons but have never attended a kingdom hall.

  i was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control?

  let's say you're a baptist.

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  Cold Steel

  The Mormon cult is definitely more stupid because there is a lot more evidence disproving more of it's ridiculous claims given how recent it's holy book is and the falsifiable nature of its claims. You have to be more gullible to join the Mormons as an adult, than to join the JWs.

  This is something that's moot at best. Most people who make such statements are completely ignorant of the facts. They read that there are no evidences on a website or in a book, then they spout it off as if they're authorities. My only point in mentioning my religion was because the JWs were insistent on making it an issue rather than actually teaching me about their religion.
  

  If people really believe there is no evidence to support the Book of Mormon, how do they explain the existence of Nahom (NHM), or the existence of Bountiful (in the exact spot it's supposed to be)?

  And how about the first Lehite encampment in Saudi Arabia? For decades critics have asked where, in Saudi Arabia, is there a "river of water" in a valley that emptied into the Red Sea? Thanks to researchers with the Nephi Project, there is such a place three days from Jerusalem (just as the Book of Mormon states). Lehi and his sons record they built an altar of stones there and there is an altar of stones at the site. Shards of pottery found at the location (identified as a campsite) dated to circa 600 B.C., the exact time of the Book of Mormon events.

  Critics ask where in the Empty Quarter Nephi could have built a ship, and where he would have found the trees, who could have helped him and where he got the tools? They point out that there is no such place with idyllic conditions, with honey, grains, fruits, tropical weather and so forth. But if one finds Nahom and goes due east (as the Book of Mormon describes), one crosses the Empty Quarter and finds a place that directly matches that description. Trees, plenty of ore for tools, builders who lived and worked there, majestic cliffs with honey bees, grains, figs and harbor areas perfect for building ships. No one in New York knew these things in 1830.
  

  One member of the party, Ishmael, died early on en route in the Book of Mormon and was buried at "a place called Nahom" (a Hebrew term meaning "comfort"). In Joseph Smith's day, no one knew that a place called Nahom existed. Critics say it's all coincidence (right!), but in 1995, archeologists began finding interred bodies at Nahom. First they found the place in the right spot and it was a "coincidence." Then it was found to be a burial site. More coincidence? Hmmm.

  For those who claim there is no evidence to support the Book of Mormon, take a look at Jeff Lindsey's Evidences website. Perhaps our critics should read a bit about these things before pontificating about it. Obviously, if the book is not what it claims it should be perfectly safe to say there's no evidence. But if I didn't think there was something to it, I wouldn't be a believer, and no one who knows me believes me to be a fool.
  

  In the LDS faith one may visit whatever church one wishes to, read any book one wishes to; there's no shunning, no one sticks their noses into what books are on the dining room table, whether you keep a gun for self defense and we can give or receive blood as necessary to preserve life. There is nothing that even approximates what JWs have to go through with their elders. There's no fear.
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  28

  Taking the Bible Lessons And Going To a KH For First Time

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've taken the bible lessons but have never attended a kingdom hall.

  i was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control?

  let's say you're a baptist.

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  Cold Steel

  Cofty » Mormon cult v JW cult. No difference.

  You mean like Communism v. Atheism. No difference.

  Magic pants, lies about American history, lies about gold plates, lies about human origins. Established by a convicted fraudster. It's a cult.

  Mere tripe. We teach nothing about magic pants, nor do we lie about gold plates (none of which had ever been discovered when the Book of Mormon story came out (1830). Joseph Smith was never convicted of being a fraud, but I concede Mormonism was a cult in the precise sense that first century Christianity was.

  Lies about human origins has yet to be established. And that's where the sore spot is with you and all religion.

  Chook » They ,WT have seduced some of the most cynical minds . By attending the KH you are waisting some of your valuable life . We all here have told you the stove is hot and we will be here to apply the bandage ,but we prefer our friends don't get burnt in the first place.

  Thanks, Chook. You, too, Level.

  Don't worry. I've been here for ten years and the JWs aren't about to entice me with anything. Their fatal flaw is that they believe God has chosen them when God has not even been in touch with them.

  
  
  

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• 
  43

  How Will Armageddon Begin?

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  and how long will it last?

  and who will come after that, yahweh, as the old testament says or jesus, as the new testament says?

  the scriptures say he'll come to the mount of olives, but surely that's a spiritual mount of olives.

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  Cold Steel

  Read Ez chapter 38 and 39, and Zechariah entire chapter 14 for the real amageddon. Absolutely nothing like the WT teaches and no living forever, etc, nor is everybody wiped out either.

  Well, at least you know your stuff. I've pointed out the same scriptures to them and they don't buy a word of it! Even if it's right there in the Bible. Everything has a spiritual interpretation with them and nothing is as it seems. Everything revolves around them.

  That said, a great deal of what they are circulates their belief structure regarding Armageddon. Not what it is biblically, but what is has become culturally.
  
  
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  28

  Taking the Bible Lessons And Going To a KH For First Time

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've taken the bible lessons but have never attended a kingdom hall.

  i was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control?

  let's say you're a baptist.

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  2. 
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  Cold Steel

  you joined this site 10 years ago--posted 100's of times--but managed to avoid attending a kingdumb hall in that time. wow

  Mostly physical, I'm afraid. I went over the handle bars of my bicycle back in 2001 and don't get out much anymore...not even to my own church. I took the lessons just to see what they were like. Didn't tell them I'm a Mormon convert, but they kept pushing. I told them I wanted to find out what was right about their beliefs and not what is wrong with mine. Still, they continued on until they promised to stay on track.

  So I told them. And the rest of the lesson went smoothly. Ah, but the next time they came, they brought an elder who I suppose had read a few anti-Mormon books. The other guy kept quiet while the elder (who sat on the edge of his seat the entire time and glowered at me menacingly) grilled me about Mormon beliefs. I didn't mind, but I told them both I was willing to continue providing we stay on topic.

  Never saw either of them again. But I found this site and have been kicking around ever since. It explained why a branch of the family fell off the side of the earth after joining the JWs. It's an interesting sect, but no, never got to a KH.

  Doesn't sound like a place I'd be comfortable being.

  
  
  
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  43

  How Will Armageddon Begin?

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  and how long will it last?

  and who will come after that, yahweh, as the old testament says or jesus, as the new testament says?

  the scriptures say he'll come to the mount of olives, but surely that's a spiritual mount of olives.

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  Cold Steel

  And how long will it last?

  And who will come after that, Yahweh, as the Old Testament says or Jesus, as the New Testament says? The scriptures say he'll come to the Mount of Olives, but surely that's a spiritual Mount of Olives. Does it mean Bethel?

  Finally, can it come any time or are there things that have to happen first?

  Will there be any advance warning from the GB?

  
  
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  28

  Taking the Bible Lessons And Going To a KH For First Time

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've taken the bible lessons but have never attended a kingdom hall.

  i was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control?

  let's say you're a baptist.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Cold Steel

  I've taken the Bible Lessons but have never attended a Kingdom Hall. I was curious as to what point they begin to tighten the screws of control? Let's say you're a Baptist. At what point do they tell you that you can't attend other churches or read anything critical of the Society?

  Also, do they print any "how to" advice on how to bring these things up with those investigating "the Truth"? Have any of you guys had to broach these topics with a new or potential convert? What do they say? I've tried to imagine how one would bring up things like this and shunning to a new member or potential convert. I mean, there's a man or woman who's being shunned right there in the Hall. You think a visitor won't notice? Or what happens if a visitor just approaches the person been shunned and introduces himself? Do the handlers say, "Hey, we're not talking to that person!"

  So can anyone help me out on this? These are tough subjects to broach. Do you wait until they're baptized before you start unloading these things on them? And when do they become subject to being shunned?
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  30

  Jesus walked into a bar...

  by Slidin Fast in

  1. social
  2. humour

  he asks the barkeep for 13 glasses of water.

  he turns to his 12 companions and winks....

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  Cold Steel

  The day is busy at Bethel. People walking the halls and carrying on their daily duties. In the offices of the Governing Body a phone rings. Mark Sanderson happens to be walking by and answers it.

  "Uh-huh," he says. "I see. Okay, I'll tell the others."

  Anthony Morris comes walking by and notices Sanderson is white as a sheet.

  "What's wrong," he says.

  "I've got some good news and some bad news," Sanderson says.

  "Well," says Morris, "what's the good news?"

  "Jesus has returned!"

  "Whaaaaa?" says Morris. "That's great! So what's the bad news?"

  Sanderson sits down and loosens his tie. "He just called from Salt Lake City!"
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  20

  If anyone claimed that god speaks to them personally.....

  by jambon1 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  they'd be viewed as completely mentally ill and laughed at.. so, how do the governing body get away with it?.

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  Cold Steel

  OnTheWayOut » We are supposed to believe that the Governing Body members are guided by spirit even though they won't say it. We aren't even supposed to know about the 2/3rds majority thing because that would help to shatter our illusions.

  Well, they certainly imply it. Here's an example from 1964:

  "The brother went down to get the mail before breakfast, and when we had breakfast he said, 'Brother Riemer, I got a new Watchtower this morning, and do you know the first thing that Ma and I do when we get that Tower? We kneel down before we take the wrapper off and ask Jehovah to make us worthy to see what the message is that Jehovah has for us. Now, before we take the wrapper off, will you kneel down and pray with us?' How different that elective elder was from this humble couple who appreciated Jehovah's organization." (Watchtower, Sept. 15, 1964, p 574)

  The Governing Body wants it both ways. The members have to live with themselves and they have to rationalize their paychecks. Everything they write, claim, teach, peach, exhort and proclaim is based on based on assumptions. There are no angels, voices, theophanies, visions or manifestations. Everything's invisible and manmade. The organization is registered legally and on paper. Christ's choosing the Society in 1918 was an assumption and was not conveyed in the manner God has employed for some six thousand years (see Amos 3:7). Then there are all those warnings about false prophets. That's got to grate on them from time to time. Even the GB members have to be subject to cognitive dissonance like everyone else.

  
  

  
  
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  44

  Why Do People Become Jehovah's Witnesses?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  besides being raised in the religion , why do people become jws?

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  Cold Steel

  People become Jehovah's Witnesses, I think, because they want to be a part of what the ancient Christians had. Many wonder why God no longer speaks to mankind as He did anciently. They see the religious world in turmoil and strife and each group has its own beliefs. They want to find truth, and the WTBTS promises them the TRUTH in a world where few have it. It also offers them exclusivity. In a world where everyone else is wrong, they belong to the small minority who's right. And when the Lord comes, He will save them to the exclusion of everyone else. (I don't think many people would become JWs for that reason -- because they want to see everyone else destroyed -- but they do want to be on the winning team.)

  But the primary thing I think they're looking for is that they want the truth. And once they accept the the JW message, it encloses them like a Venus Fly Trap. Suddenly you're restricted in what you can read and you can't visit other churches or listen to their religious messages. They take up your free time and you're under observation much of the time. And after a few years they can pretty much run your life for noncompliance.